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[Dale Eastman]

The “right” to own property comes from government ..... the “ability” to own property comes from natural law ..... survival of the fittest

IMO, you got that backwards.

Dale Eastman because you haven’t thought it through .....

Let's assume that I haven't thought this through. Please educate me. Scratch that. I'm curious as to your thoughts on the issue.

Dale Eastman let’s say you have property that you believe you have the right to own .... someone comes along and decides to take it from you .... there are two things that could stop them from taking it, .... laws and government or you being stronger and more powerful than they are.

Thank you for this discussion.
Sorry for the delay in responding. I've several "discussions" clamoring for my attention. Yours intrigues me the most.

➽ let’s say you have property that you believe you have the right to own .... someone comes along and decides to take it from you .... there are two things that could stop them from taking it, .... laws and government or you being stronger and more powerful than they are.

I have a specific property that I own. I have a right to that property. My life is my property.

What, specifically, is a "right"?

What, specifically, is a "right to life"?

Does a poisonous critter understand that you or I have a "right to life"? The answer to that is an obvious "negative". Brown recluse spiders have no concept of a human's "right to life."

Unlike government agents who willfully violate other humans' "rights to life", brown recluse spiders don't attack humans who have done them no harm.

Now your comment about laws is simply in error. There have been laws against murder since time immemorial. There have been murders since time immemorial. Laws didn't do shit to protect humans' rights to life.

Now you have claimed that government protects rights. Your failure to understand the untruth of that comment does not surprise me. I used to believe that indoctrinated BS until I rejected and shed my brainwashing.

Government extorts humans.  Every time, past, present, future.

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman go ahead and try to exercise your “right” to own property without government and laws to protect that right ..... I dare you.

I did not expect to trigger you so early in the discussion.

You have not answered this question:
What, specifically, is a "right"?

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman seems to me you’re the one who’s triggered ..... you must not be used to interacting with someone you can’t baffle with your bullshit ..... if you really need to know the specific definition of a right you should Google it.

No, I don't need the specific definition of a right.
I need to know what, exactly, you mean when you use the word "right."

Which specific words of mine are you calling "bullshit"?

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman The only thing you need to know about me is that I don’t gather information to form my opinions on any subject from idiots on Facebook.

I know everything I need to know about you in regard to one thing only.

You make claims and refuse to answer questions about your claims.

Your specific claim:
➽ you must not be used to interacting with someone you can’t baffle with your bullshit

My specific question about your claim:
Which specific words of mine are you calling "bullshit"?

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman Everything you’ve said here should be considered bullshit .... you’re nothing but a troll who hasn’t proven my original comment incorrect in any way.

➽ The “right” to own property comes from government

I suppose you are going to claim that my right to life comes from government.

[Dale Eastman]

The “right” to own property comes from government ..... the “ability” to own property comes from natural law ..... survival of the fittest

➽ The “right” to own property comes from government

I'm sorry. The communication error is mine. Not enough detail. My bad.

My life is my property.

Are you going to claim that my right to life comes from government?

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman you need to stop commenting here and tagging me until after you look up the definition of a right! 🙄🙄

My life is my property.
Are you going to claim that my right to life comes from government?

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman I see you haven’t googled the definition of a “right” yet ..... 🙄🙄

I see you are still refusing to answer a question about YOUR claim.

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman i’m not here to educate people ..... my comment is written in plain English ..... if you’re too lazy or stupid to look up the definition of a word you don’t understand you’re beyond educating anyway.

Correct. You're not here to educate, you're here to propagandize your religious cult of government.

Rights to life came BEFORE government.

20 Points of YDOM

(1) YDOM! You don't own me!
(2) You do not have a "right to control" me.
(3) You do not have "authority" over me.
(4) My body; my life; my labor; the results of my labor; property received in exchange for my labor, are all my property.
(5) My rights are my property.
(6) My right to make my own choices is my property.
(7) You do not have a "right to control" my property.
(8 ) I have the highest "right to control" in regard to any of my property.
(9) Concurrent with my "right to control" my property is my right to protect, defend, and secure my property from any entity that caused harm, attempted to cause harm, or intends to cause harm.
(10) Any attempt to take my property against my will or without my permission, whether by force or by fraud, is an intent to cause harm.
(11) Any attempt to damage my property is an intent to cause harm.

(12) This highest "right to control" is the same for every human.
(13) These are the equal rights addressed in the United States' Declaration of Independence.

(14) No human can delegate a "right to control" that they do not have.
(15) Voting can not delegate a "right to control" that the voter does not have.

(16) Governments are always comprised of humans.
(17) Humans that comprise "government" do not own me; do not have a "right to control" me; do not have a right to make rules I must allegedly obey; do not have a right to violate another human's rights.
(18) Humans that comprise "government" do not have a "right to control" me just because they occupy a government office.
(19) Humans that comprise "government" can not delegate a "right to control" (that they do not have) to the reified entity called "government".
(20) YDOM means there can not be any rulers with a "right to control" any other human.

That to secure these rights,
Governments are instituted among Men,
deriving their just powers
from the consent of the governed...

A YDOMist, demanding proof of consent, would demand:
Where are the notarized records, proving consent
and recording the terms agreed thereto, presently stored?

synapticsparks.info/YDOM

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman without government and laws, (or your physical ability to enforce them yourself), your 20 points don’t exist!

Dale Eastman and, ..... maybe you should look a little closer at the meme you just posted ..... especially the part where it says “to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men”

Maybe YOU should look closer at the part of the meme you ignored:
from the consent of the governed...

A YDOMist, demanding proof of consent, would demand:
Where are the notarized records, proving consent
and recording the terms agreed thereto, presently stored?

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman Those notarized recorded documents are on file at your county (government) clerks office protecting your right to own your property ..... without it, (the county clerks office), your right only extends to the point that you can enforce it.

Dale Eastman and I didn’t ignore the part where it says “from the consent of the governed” ..... it appears you did ..... the statement in its totality clearly says if you don’t consent to be governed your rights are not secure.

➽ I didn’t ignore the part where it says “from the consent of the governed” ..... it appears you did ..... the statement in its totality clearly says if you don’t consent to be governed your rights are not secure.

Here's the part you ignored or mis-read: "Where are the notarized records, proving consent
and recording the terms agreed thereto, presently stored?"

Show me YOUR notarized record where you consented to "government's" rules... The terms consented to.
In other words, I await you to provide the rules to me exactly as they were presented to you to agree to and consent to obey.

Also the date the offer was presented and the date you agreed and consented.

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman you are correct ..... I did ignore your demand for notarized documents proving your consent to be governed because I don’t recognize your right to do so. The fact that you occupy space within the boundaries of the area claimed by men who have consented implies your consent. If you don’t like it, you should leave.

The entire problem here is you don’t understand what a right is and who grants it to you .....

➽ I did ignore your demand ... because I don’t recognize your RIGHT to do so.

Remember this comment?

No, I don't need the specific definition of a right. I need to know what, exactly, you mean when you use the word "right."

So let me help you help me understand what you are saying.

You did ignore my demand ... because you don’t recognize my XXXXX? to make demands of you.

What, exactly, you mean when you use the word "XXXXX"?

https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/WBdvyyHLdxZSAMmoz/taboo-your-words

➽     The entire problem here is you don’t understand what a right is and who grants it to you

Thank you for clarifying what our communication issue is. Rights are not granted. Privileges are granted, and privileges can be revoked.

According to you, government grants me my right to life. According to that errant thinking, government can rescind my right to life.

So tell me, who gave government the right to decide who lives and who dies?

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman and I never said the government had the right to decide who lives and who dies ..... now you’re just gaslighting.

➽ The entire problem here is you don’t understand what a right is and who grants it to you

Admit or deny: According to you, government grants me my right to life.

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman like I’ve said repeatedly the entire problem here is you don’t understand what a right is ..... go troll someone else.

Dale Eastman like I’ve said repeatedly the entire problem here is you don’t understand what a right is ..... go troll someone else.

Typical...
You're one of those who make claims and then can't, or won't back them up.

Here's your claims:

➽ The “right” to own property comes from government

My life is my property. According to you, my right to my life comes from government.

➽ you must not be used to interacting with someone you can’t baffle with your bullshit

I'm quite used to people like you who refuse to even attempt to back up their claims with substantive information.

➽ Everything you’ve said here should be considered bullshit

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur. Also: Pot-Kettle-Black.

➽ I did ignore your demand ... because I don’t recognize your RIGHT to do so.

I'm sorry. What do you not recognize about my demand?

➽ The entire problem here is you don’t understand what a right is and who grants it to you

You don't understand the difference between a right and a privilege.

[Dale Eastman]

Dale Eastman I don’t need to back up my claims ..... they are just common sense ..... the entire problem is you don’t know, and refuse to look up, the definition of a right.

➽ Dale Eastman I don’t need to back up my claims ..... they are just common sense

That, ⇈⇈⇈⇈, is yet another claim.
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.

➽ my claims ..... they are just common sense

That, ⇈⇈⇈⇈, is yet another claim.
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.

➽ the entire problem is you don’t know,

That, ⇈⇈⇈⇈, is yet another claim.
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
You are assuming.
BTW, you are assuming in error.

➽ and refuse to look up, the definition of a right.

A dictionary is NOT going to show me what, exactly, YOU mean when YOU use the word "right".

I think you are a smurfid smurfer smurfing smurf-smurf.

The entire problem is you don’t know, and refuse to look up, the definition of smurf... And you gasorminumplaz also.

➽ The “right” to own property comes from government
➽ Dale Eastman let’s say you have property that you believe you have the right to own

My life is my property. I believe I have a right to own my life.

➽ someone comes along and decides to take it from you

Someone comes along and decides to take my life from me.

➽ there are two things that could stop them from taking it,

Actually, there is a third thing that Would stop them from taking my life. Since you have no clue what that third thing is, I am suspicious of you being one of those who would come along and attempt to take my life.

➽ laws and government

Laws against murder have existed since time immemorial. Murders have existed since time immemorial. So you are wrong about the protection of law.

Laws and government have existed together since time immemorial. So have murders.

So you are in error on that point.

I have not challenged you as to what, exactly, you mean when you use the word "government"... Yet.

➽ or you being stronger and more powerful than they are.

Not enough specifics to agree or disagree in any general case.

➽ Dale Eastman I don’t need to back up my claims

⍺ ⍺ ⍺ ⍺ ⍺
Burden of proof is a philosophical concept that refers to the obligation to provide supporting evidence for a claim. It plays an important role in a variety of argumentation contexts, and it's a key principle to making valid statements; all logical arguments need to have sufficient evidence to back up their conclusions.
https://fallacyinlogic.com/burden-of-proof-fallacy-definition-and-examples/
Ω Ω Ω Ω Ω

➽ The “right” to own property comes from government
➽ Dale Eastman let’s say you have property that you believe you have the right to own

My life is my property. I believe I have a right to own my life.

➽ someone comes along and decides to take it from you

Someone, Lon Tomohisa Horiuchi, a member of government, comes along and decides to take my life from me.

I'd bet you know nothing about:
"Lon Tomohisa Horiuchi is an American former Federal Bureau of Investigation Hostage Rescue Team sniper and former United States Army officer who was involved in the 1992 Ruby Ridge standoff and 1993 Waco siege."